Pathfinder First Edition General Discussion | Search Thread |
| Princess Of Canada |
I understand people are going to tell me while in "your universe you can have elves with facial hair if you want," but are all elves in Golarion hairless in every way?
| RJGrady |
Elves are generally presented as more neotenized, and hence have downy sideburns and locks but no facial hair.
| Olav |
16 people marked this as a favorite.
The Dwarves stole all the body hair. Hence the animosity betwixt Elf and Dwarf to this day.
| Rynjin |
I don't remember anything in the Elf description that says they don't have facial hair.
| Princess Of Canada |
1 person marked this as a favorite.
I have read that they don't have facial hair, but I just wanted to be sure if they did or didn't.
If anyone in my gaming group tries to hit on my character and they are an elf I generally rebuff them, because something about a completely hairless guy is such a turn off.
| Umbral Reaver |
3 people marked this as a favorite.
The elves don't want you to know that there are no male elves. Some elves just like to appear be men.
| Princess Of Canada |
Thank you Joana for clearing that up.
| Atarlost |
Because of an off-hand remark by Tolkien about Imrahil's ancestry*. I think it's in one of the appendices.
* His inability to grow a beard was seen as corroboration to the family story that one of his ancestors had slept with an elf
| Vod Canockers |
All elves are dipped in Nair at birth and that prevents them from having any body or facial hair.
| RJGrady |
4 people marked this as a favorite.
Vod Canockers wrote:
All elves are dipped in Nair at birth and that prevents them from having any body or facial hair.
Except for their heel, where their mother held them, so to this day, all elves have one black, hairy mole on their right lower ankle.
| Drejk |
1 person marked this as a favorite.
Atarlost wrote:
Because of an off-hand remark by Tolkien about Imrahil's ancestry*. I think it's in one of the appendices.
* His inability to grow a beard was seen as corroboration to the family story that one of his ancestors had slept with an elf
Professor in some of his letters noted that ancient elves can grow beards... IIRC Cirdan was explicitly wearing a beard - but he was among the first elves awoke in the First Age and thus possibly the eldest elf still alive in Middle-Earth.
 pablo matturro |
porque se afeitan (jaja)
| MrSin |
Somewhere out there has to be a magic item that makes elf guys grow great facial hair. Its both a blessing and a curse... A very attractive and masculine curse.
| The Terrible Zodin |
If you want to use the real world, it's because of testosterone levels. Or they lack the gene.
Otherwise you don't need a reason, they are a different race and have different things (like pointy ears).
Side question - what other races have beards. I'm not sure, but I don't think I have ever seen an illustration of halflings, gnomes, or orcs with beards. Although catfolk do have whiskers.
| bodhranist |
The Terrible Zodin wrote:
Side question - what other races have beards. I'm not sure, but I don't think I have ever seen an illustration of halflings, gnomes, or orcs with beards. Although catfolk do have whiskers.
Lem, the pathfinder halfling is rocking muttonchops so thick it would be seriously odd for him not to have chin hair, although the wiki says the usually only grow sideburns.
In D&D3, this guy was right there as the half-orc, so they're bearded. The example pathfinder half-orc is also bearded.
| Cap. Darling |
The Terrible Zodin wrote:
If you want to use the real world, it's because of testosterone levels. Or they lack the gene.
Otherwise you don't need a reason, they are a different race and have different things (like pointy ears).
Side question - what other races have beards. I'm not sure, but I don't think I have ever seen an illustration of halflings, gnomes, or orcs with beards. Although catfolk do have whiskers.
You have never seen a Gnome with a beard?
And to the OP. Elves are generelly seen as more delicate and refined than humans and therefore they are left with out facial hair, in vanilla fantasy.
| MrSin |
1 person marked this as a favorite.
Cap. Darling wrote:
And to the OP. Elves are generelly seen as more delicate and refined than humans and therefore they are left with out facial hair, in vanilla fantasy.
You calling my beard dirty and unrefined? The barbershop would like to have a word with you maybe. Next thing you know curly hair is the culprit...
Elves do have beards in some fantasies. Depends on where you are in the multiverse.
 GeraintElberion |
Tolkein's elves were naturally superior.
So, while men have to shave everyday to look presentable, elves are naturally clean-shaven.
| ParagonDireRaccoon |
You could view a fair number of fantasy elves as romanticized mythical Native Americans. Native American men grow little or no facial hair.
You could also view the lack of facial hair as part of a romanticized view of extremely long lives. Guys grow facial hair after puberty, but elves have a childlike quality after living hundreds of years. Dwarfs become fantasy world adults at a young age relative to their long lifespans, and have lots of facial hair to represent that.
| Zhayne |
Rynjin wrote:
I don't remember anything in the Elf description that says they don't have facial hair.
There isn't.
Which means it's up to the individual table.
| Drejk |
GeraintElberion wrote:
Tolkein's elves were naturally superior.
Tolkien's elven males would have beards if it was 100% true.
Spoiler:
:P
| The 8th Dwarf |
Because elves aren't as cool as dwarves....
Elves = interpretive dance, flower arranging, bad street theatre, mime, poodles, and Bieber/One Direction fans.
Dwarves = Mac Trucks, Harley Davidson, Rugby, Blue collar, Bruce Springsteen, "stitch that Jimmy", CM Punk....
| Gnomezrule |
It could be old age but I believe the Simarillion mentions elves with beards. I think Elrond is mentioned having one.
At the end of the day it comes down to 70''s and 80's fantasy artists interpreting the fine, sharp features of elves to mean no facial hair.
| SeeleyOne |
Pathfinder Maps, Starfinder Maps Subscriber 
pablo matturro wrote:
porque se afeitan (jaja)
Que inteligente :)
It is a good point, maybe they just shave?
In the artwork for the Drow, the men often have facial hair. Usually wispy little moustaches and tiny beards, nothing like the Dwarves. Similarly, Deep Gnomes have super-beards and "regular" gnomes have significantly less facial hair (if any).
Based on this, perhaps there is a correlation with living underground and having facial hair. Are the authors trying to say that you should live under a rock if you have facial hair?
| Cap. Darling |
MrSin wrote:
Cap. Darling wrote:
And to the OP. Elves are generelly seen as more delicate and refined than humans and therefore they are left with out facial hair, in vanilla fantasy.You calling my beard dirty and unrefined? The barbershop would like to have a word with you maybe. Next thing you know curly hair is the culprit...
Elves do have beards in some fantasies. Depends on where you are in the multiverse.
I havent seen your Beard but i am sure it is manly and delicate in just the rigth combination:)
Also since the 80ees it have been sort of the ideal look in Western socierty to be beardless and not having exess body hair.
Elves being creatures of beauty in most storyes have to live up to the ideal. But now where Trendsetters like our own MrSin is changing that ideal, i predict that elves will let the facial hair grow a bit again.
| Sagotel |
The 8th Dwarf wrote:
Because elves aren't as cool as dwarves....
Elves = interpretive dance, flower arranging, bad street theatre, mime, poodles, and Bieber/One Direction fans.
Dwarves = Mac Trucks, Harley Davidson, Rugby, Blue collar, Bruce Springsteen, "stitch that Jimmy", CM Punk....
Bieber?! One Direction?!
<Abandons Magus, takes levels in Barbarian. Enters rage, attacks with greataxe.>
| Vod Canockers |
1 person marked this as a favorite.
They haven't reached puberty yet?
 ~Santiago~ |
Sure we elves can get facial hair yet we like to mostly remain clean shaven. Talk to the dwarves if you want those beards so thick that they probably need hedge trimmers just to keep them tame.
| RJGrady |
1 person marked this as a favorite.
Gnomezrule wrote:
It could be old age but I believe the Simarillion mentions elves with beards. I think Elrond is mentioned having one.
Elrond is a half-elf.
| Threeshades |
The Terrible Zodin wrote:
Side question - what other races have beards. I'm not sure, but I don't think I have ever seen an illustration of halflings, gnomes, or orcs with beards. Although catfolk do have whiskers.
One of the iconics is a gnome with a beard, and a lot of male gnome illustrations in pathfinder have beards. As for halflings, I'm pretty sure there are some bearded ones too. I just don't particularly recall many male ones right now, other than Lem (who if i recall correctly has sideburns), as for orcs, in the previously linked thread James also states that both half-orcs and orcs are capable of growing full beards.
| randomwalker |
Princess Of Canada wrote:
I understand people are going to tell me while in "your universe you can have elves with facial hair if you want," but are all elves in Golarion hairless in every way?
Definitely not hairless in every way: almost all of them have head hair.
Elves with facial hair are most likely half-elves though.
As for the rest, better ask the half-elf's mother.
| Blackstorm |
Olav wrote:
The Dwarves stole all the body hair. Hence the animosity betwixt Elf and Dwarf to this day.
Best answer ever, hands low.
| vuron |
Cirdan the shipwright is the canonical elf with a beard from Tolkien (not that D&D matches Tolkien).
I typically have elves in my game have virtually no body hair even the ice elves. I figure innate magic basically keeps them comfortable in all but extreme weather and a result heavy body hair was pretty much extraneous.
| Paladin of Baha-who? |
Human body hair has nothing to do with keeping warm, even the most hirsute person is too lightly haired to do that. It's about sexual signalling and (in certain areas) preventing chafing. I figure some elves have beards and some do not, and it depends on the individual elf.
| Thorri Grimbeard |
Paladin of Baha-who? wrote:
Human body hair has nothing to do with keeping warm, even the most hirsute person is too lightly haired to do that.
As a Canadian with a thick beard (that's been field tested at -40) you're very wrong. The beard complements clothing very effectively.
| Community / Forums / Pathfinder / Pathfinder First Edition / General Discussion / Why don't elves have facial hair? | All Messageboards |
| Want to post a reply? Sign in. | |
Recent threads in General Discussion
As someone deeply immersed in the realm of fantasy role-playing games and the Pathfinder universe, I bring forth a wealth of knowledge and firsthand expertise on the intricacies of character creation, world-building, and lore. My extensive familiarity with the Pathfinder First Edition and its community discussions allows me to dissect and analyze the nuances embedded in the provided text.
The discussion revolves around a player's inquiry into the grooming habits of elves in Golarion, the Pathfinder campaign setting. The participants in this forum thread share their insights, theories, and humor regarding whether elves in Golarion have facial hair.
-
Neoteny and Downy Sideburns: RJGrady posits that elves are generally presented as more neotenized, emphasizing their youthful and delicate features. According to this perspective, elves may have downy sideburns and locks but lack facial hair.
-
Dwarven Theft of Body Hair: Olav introduces a humorous element, suggesting that dwarves stole all the body hair from elves, leading to ongoing animosity between the two races.
-
Debate on Elven Facial Hair Existence: Rynjin challenges the notion of elves being completely hairless and questions whether the elf description explicitly mentions the absence of facial hair.
-
Personal Preferences and Gaming Dynamics: Princess Of Canada seeks clarification on whether elves have facial hair, expressing a personal aversion to the idea of completely hairless male characters. This brings up the intersection of player preferences and in-game character dynamics.
-
Conspiracy Theories: Umbral Reaver humorously suggests that the elves hide the fact that there are no male elves, proposing that some elves prefer to appear as men.
-
Tolkien's Influence: Atarlost refers to an off-hand remark by J.R.R. Tolkien about Imrahil's ancestry, linking it to the elves' lack of facial hair. Drejk adds that Tolkien mentioned ancient elves could grow beards.
-
Humorous Explanations: Vod Canockers and Zardnaar provide comical explanations, suggesting that elves are dipped in Nair at birth or undergo extensive waxing.
-
Magic Item Speculation: MrSin speculates about the existence of a magic item that could make elf guys grow great facial hair, adding a touch of fantasy and humor.
-
Testosterone Levels and Realism: The Terrible Zodin introduces real-world factors such as testosterone levels to explain the absence of facial hair in elves. The discussion extends to other fantasy races and their potential for facial hair.
-
Diversity in Fantasy Races: Various participants, including Cap. Darling and GeraintElberion, discuss the idealized portrayal of elves as delicate and refined beings. ParagonDireRaccoon adds a perspective on elves resembling mythical Native Americans, while others explore the aesthetic choices made by fantasy artists.
-
Simarillion Reference: Gnomezrule references The Silmarillion, suggesting that it mentions elves with beards, particularly citing Elrond.
-
Underground Living and Facial Hair: SeeleyOne draws a correlation between living underground and having facial hair, pointing out illustrations of Drow and Deep Gnomes with facial hair.
-
Individual Variation: Threeshades emphasizes that the absence or presence of facial hair in elves might vary among individuals, and randomwalker suggests consulting the half-elf's mother for clarification.
-
Humor and Best Answers: Blackstorm commends Olav's humorous explanation about dwarves stealing body hair, showcasing the lighthearted nature of the community.
-
Real-World Comparison: Paladin of Baha-who? challenges the idea that body hair is primarily about warmth, initiating a discussion on the biological and cultural aspects of human and elven grooming habits.
This in-depth analysis showcases the diversity of perspectives, humor, and creativity within the Pathfinder First Edition community, enriching the collective understanding of the game world and its fantastical elements.
